You are listening to the Roberta Glass True Crime Report, putting the true back in true crime.

From New York City, Roberta Glass is now on the record.

My guest Sarah Berman is an investigative journalist and former senior editor at Vice.

Based in Vancouver, Canada, her new book, Don't Call It a Cult, gives a millennials take on the nexium story.

Peppered with hip and edgy references, Don't Call It a Cult, is both a history of the cult and a snapshot of today's culture, values, issues, and interests. Welcome, Sarah Berman. Of course. Yeah, thanks for

having me. You're welcome. So why did you dedicate this book to the women who change their minds?

So the dedication is, I guess, a reference to all the women in this book who got enclosed in

a closed system of thinking and weren't able to get new information and build a new idea

about what was happening to them. So I think anyone who

gets new information and changes their mind, that's a beautiful thing that I would just always

want to support. So just not being tied into someone identity, that was what got women into

this group was wanting to change their identity and transform.

And it just so happened to be this closed and controlling system that they got into.

So yeah, it's just in general, like women should do what they please, should be as free as

anyone.

That's what I'm hoping for. I mean,

that's a big theme of this podcast is why people change their minds and how they change their mind.

So I really love that. So did you change your mind on anything about nexium? Did you have preconceived notions? Were there things that blew your mind or changed your mind or

you realized you got wrong when you started to cover this story? Oh, totally. I felt like the bottom

fell out of the story so, so many times. I would get into a very trusting relationship with a

particular source and then I'd be like, wait a second,

are they trying to misrepresent or, you know, what's happening here? Just as revelations came out,

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