Hi, I'm Anouche. I'm Alfa. And I'm Steven.

And on today's New Statesman podcast, we discuss the reshuffle and you ask us about Steven's

interview with Kirstama. So we're recording something in the aftermath of the main reshuffle

events while junior posts are still being decided. Some of the biggest moves were Dominic

Raab being moved from Foreign Secretary to Justice Secretary and being replaced by Liz

Trass in that great office of state. So that was one of the biggest moves. And then something

else that has got people's heads scratching is Nadine Doris as Culture Secretary and

as well as that Nadine Zahawi has gone from being the vaccinations minister to heading

up the DFE. What do you two make of it? You've been looking at some of the biggest moves?

I think probably the thing to think about first is actually how interesting it is that it

even happened because this has been rumored for quite a while that Boris Johnson knew he

needed to have a reshuffle, a kind of planned one. There were points over the summer and

also last week where it was definitely going ahead and then it looks as though he personally

got cold feet. So Steven has had very strong views on this that maybe Boris Johnson would

never get right into doing it, which even though disproven I think is completely true to what

we have observed of him over the past few months that this is a prime minister who doesn't really

enjoy sacking people. I had a conversation with someone earlier talking about their story they've

heard about Boris Johnson trying to sack someone at the spectator years ago when he was editor

and I think he didn't end up sacking that person. It went very differently. Some of the story is

redacted and so I think it's interesting that clearly he has decided to go for it and to risk

ruffling a few feathers and cracking some eggs basically mainly to promote people who've been

loyal to him, which is just such an interesting theme because the problem that Boris Johnson has

...