Welcome to Pushback. I'm Aaron Mate. It did not seem possible for the steel dossier,

the collection of Trump-Russia conspiracy theories, funded by the Clinton campaign,

hyped by the U.S. media, and relied on by the FBI to get more embarrassing for all those involved.

But the latest indictment from special counsel John Durham has done just that.

Steele's key source, a U.S.-based Russian expat named Igor Denchenko, is now accused of lying to the FBI.

And the details add new humiliation

for those who promoted Steele as credible

and raise new questions about the FBI's handling

of the Trump-Russia probe.

Joining me is Barry Meyer.

He's a veteran Pulitzer Prize winning journalist.

His latest book includes extensive reporting

on the Steele dossier.

It's called Spooked, the Trump Dossier, Black Cube,

and the rise of private spies.

Barry, thank you for joining me.

Sure thing, Aaron. Thanks for having me.

So we knew before from Inspector General Michael Horowitz

in a December 2019 report that Denchenko had admitted to the FBI

that he was Steele's main source and

that corroboration for his claims was zero, in his words, zero.

But now we get a whole new series of details, including that Durham is accusing him of lying

...