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From Cafe in the Vox Media Podcast Network, this is StayTuned in Brief. I'm Creed Barara.

Today is Martin Luther King Jr. Day, and to honor the great civil rights leader,

I wanted to spend some time talking about his impact on our politics today and also about his legacy.

My guest is Dr. Andra Gillespie. She's a professor of political science at Emory University,

and an expert in campaigns, elections, and voting behavior. Her work is focused on black politics,

particularly the leaders of the post-civil rights generation. Dr. Gillespie, thanks for joining me.

Thank you.

So obviously, we could talk for hours and hours and days and days about the Reverend Martin Luther King Jr.

But I thought on a day like this, there are a few spots we could hit and talk about Dr. King.

So remind folks who may not be so well versed and who understand Dr. King to be basically universally revered,

at least by people's rhetoric, if not necessarily always in their hearts, that when he was alive

and at the maximum of his power, at the maximum of his popularity, how popular was he?

He wasn't universally popular at the height of his notoriety.

So we think about that period in the early to mid 1960s, say from the March on Washington,

to the time that he came out against the Vietnam War.

If you look at public opinion data from that era, you actually find out that he's a pretty controversial figure.

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