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Criminal

"If it ever happens, run."

Criminal

Vox Media Podcast Network

True Crime, Society & Culture, Documentary

4.738.4K Ratings

🗓️ 12 February 2021

⏱️ 36 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

“What I recall most is the way that she grabbed my wrist and, shaking a bit, she said over and over again, ‘If it happens, run. Don’t let that happen to you. Run. If it ever happens, run.’” It was years before Cynthia Brown understood what her great-grandmother, Athalia Howe, was talking about. Athalia Howe grew up in Wilmington, North Carolina in the late 1890s. At the time, Wilmington was called “the freest town in the country” for Black people, and by 1898, Black men had become integral in Wilmington’s government. White Supremacists in the state were determined to stop them, by "ballot or bullet or both.” David Zucchino's book is Wilmington's Lie: The Murderous Coup of 1898 and the Rise of White Supremacy. Say hello on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram. Sign up for our occasional newsletter, The Accomplice. Follow the show and review us on Apple Podcasts: iTunes.com/CriminalShow. We also make This is Love and Phoebe Reads a Mystery. Artwork by Julienne Alexander. Check out our online shop. Episode transcripts are posted on our website. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0

Support for this show comes from Krakan.

0:03.0

Krypto is like the financial system, but different.

0:07.0

It doesn't care where you come from, what you look like, your credit score,

0:11.0

or your outrageous food delivery habits.

0:13.7

crypto is finance for everyone everywhere all the time.

0:18.4

Krakhan, see what crypto can be.

0:21.3

Don't invest unless you're prepared to lose all the money you invest.

0:25.0

This is a high-risk investment and you should not expect to be protected if something goes wrong.

0:31.3

This episode contains descriptions of violence.

0:34.0

Please use discretion.

0:37.0

When I was a young girl, perhaps I was just around 10 years old. My mother took me and my brother to visit my great

0:49.9

grandmother in Pennsylvania. Her name was a failure, but we just always called her

0:58.0

Thalia, Grandma Thalia. She was bedridden. I recall going up the stairs in her home and I recall seeing

1:09.6

her in bed in and out of consciousness.

1:13.4

I don't know what her exact health issue was,

1:17.8

but I recall her being excited

1:20.3

and appearing to be happy when she saw us come into the room.

1:25.0

I went to the bedside just beside her and I remember her looking over at me and in a very almost panic-stricken way she began to

1:39.5

ramble about not letting that happen to me. I did not understand. I did not know what she was

1:48.6

referring to. And I gather that I looked confused and concerned.

1:57.0

My mother didn't fully understand either.

2:00.1

But then within moments, her level of anxiety increased just so much.

...

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