I'm just a pole wayfare and stranger traveling through. driving through this world below.

Lord I swear there's no pain.

I know there's no day. Bill let's take a look at an article.

Bill, let's take a look at an article and I know that this blog is going to be probably a little sarcastic.

The name of it is another white atheist in Colombia and M.L. Clark is the author. It's humanism and the real problem

of suffering. The writer says that regular readers know that I get pretty grumpy when addressing

the Christian Bible's awful morality. So I try to limit how often I focus on this text and the figure of Christ represented within it.

And he says, I'm strongly of the opinion that fixating on religion's textual flaws is not a useful way of building a more robustly

secular state and in general I find the whole theist atheist divide to be a

distraction right there Bill our secularist friends are interested in

building a secular society. Yes, I have found that there are two types of humanists with whom I've actually debated.

One would be what one might call philosophical humanists who believe that God does not exist and the human beings are

the locus of moral value. The other type of humanist isn't really concerned about

metaphysical issues like the existence of God. This is what you might call a social humanist. And what these

humanists are really interested in is promoting their political agenda as this author says building a more robustly secular state securing

rights for humanists, making sure that the public square is devoid of religious discourse and

that the schools are free of religious influence this sort of social concern. And for my part Kevin, as you might imagine, I think that the

theist, atheist debate is absolutely central to the question of humanism and cannot be ignored as a mere

distraction. In one of the very first debates I ever participated in with Fred Edwards from the American Humanist Association.

I presented a dilemma to Edwards. I argue that if God exists, then humanism is not true, because God is the locus and source of moral values.

On the other hand, if God does not exist, humanism is not true because we're landed in moral nihilism.

Since God either exists or does not exist, it follows necessarily that therefore humanism is not true.

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