Get ready to enter the Drive Time Show.

All right, Thrive Nation. Welcome back to the Drive Time Show. My name is Clay Clark. I'm the former USSBA entrepreneur of the year.

And I am joined here with my partner, Dr. Robert Zelner. And Z, we are interviewing an incredible guest today, my friend.

Dan the man. Yes, Dan Heath. Dan, this is something that you might find interesting. I have attended a local mega church. And when the senior pastors at this church, he says, you have to read this book. And that book was made to stick. And that's how I first got introduced to your writing. So apparently pastors of mega churches like what you are writing.

Wow, yeah, it's not it's not often that people discover our work in church. So that's that's good to hear. Yeah, so it's been a it's a book I referenced at least once a week and it's powerful. So if you're out there and you're wanting to become a more effective speaker or more effective copywriter or advertiser out encouraged to check out the book made to stick.

But since then you've actually been working on this book, you release this book called the power of moments. And for our listeners out there that aren't familiar with the your newest book, the power of moments, can you share what this book is is all about and what what inspired you to write this book.

Absolutely. I mean, in one word, the power of moments is a book about experience. It's about how do we create better experiences for the people we serve, you know, our customers, our patients, our students.

How do we create better experiences for our kids and for ourselves and life. And in the starting place for this book is something you might think of as the Disney paradox, which anybody that's ever been to a theme park before I think can relate to this.

And what I mean by that is that if we were to track your happiness levels on a moment by moment basis, you know, during your time at Disney World, let's say, my guess is that the vast majority of those measurements would actually be worse at the theme park than they would have been if you were sitting on your couch at home.

So hot because on the surface of the sun. Yeah, I mean, it's blazing hot. It's humid. There are these 45 minute lines to ride like a two minute dumbbell ride you would have preferred not to be on at the begin with.

It's expensive and the traffic back and forth and the parking. And yet, there are a couple of things that will happen at the theme park that will be memorable. Right. Your kids will light up over some ride that they rode or, you know, one of the characters will come by and you'll take a picture.

You'll be looking out for 20 years or you'll have one of those moments as a parent where you're just, you know, reveling in the joy of having this child.

And those couple of moments, they may be a minority of the day. They might be 15 minutes out of an eight hour day. And yet, a year later, if you look back and you say, hey, how is your trip to Disney World? You know what you're going to say? You say, it was amazing.

It was one of the highlights of the year. And so that's the paradox that I'm talking about how in the moment, an experience can feel one way and yet we feel very different about it looking back.

And I think the significance of that, the kind of takeaway lesson is that when we talk about improving experience, what we're really talking about are creating moments.

And in the book, we call them peak moments that great experiences hinge on peak moments. And so the book is really an attempt to figure out how do we create more of these memorable, meaningful peaks?

You know, this for me is a peak moment because I've read your stuff and I am so I just the level of research that you put into your books that you and your brother put into your books is absolutely. I mean this with all your respect. It's insane. It's maniacal. It's intense.

I mean, it is detailed. You guys obsess about an idea and you have so much data to support what you're saying. I just want to ask you this. Do you remember the moment where you were and the impactful moment where you thought, I need to write a book called the power of moments. Did you did you hit your head on the toilet seat after watching back to the future?

What what what is because you, I mean, when you write a book, you guys aren't screwing around. I mean, these are these Charlottes and half research, half baked books. I mean, you guys go deep. And that's what makes your books so powerful. I mean, you're just you guys really go deep. What inspired you to write this book?

You know, we actually have a perfectly identifiable moment for this book, which I guess is appropriate, giving the subject, but it happens one Christmas, a couple of years back when Chip and I were together at our parents house.

And as we often do, we had scroll ourselves away and in our dad's office to talk about what we were working on. And we walked in the office that day with a different book idea. In fact, we'd been working on this particular idea for probably six or eight months by that point.

And it was one of those things that had just become a bit of a slog. You know, we had done enough work where we were really reluctant to let it go. And yet I don't think either one of us were super excited about it.

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