You will not have an honest or authentic conversation with someone running for office unless they're not running for office anymore.

Unless they're checking out and about to write a book. Hello, Liz Cheney.

Yeah, exactly.

So we listen to a lot of political podcasts around here. It's kind of part of the job.

And one of our favorite shows is called

Somebody's Got a Win, hosted by Tara Palmary. Now, it's a collaboration between the sports

and Culture Network, The Ringer, and Puck News. And that's where Tara is a senior political correspondent.

And her show is smart and funny. I always learned something when I listen. So I wanted to invite

her here to the assignment to compare notes on covering politics in 2023.

Welcome to the program.

Thanks so much for having me.

I've been a huge fan of your show.

So it is a pleasure to be on.

Well, I'm excited to talk to you because I feel like I had the experience of covering political campaigns during these big periods of transition.

Where you are in that moment, I think, can affect your view of politics. So where did you start? What was your first campaign?

My first campaign, I mean, I had a different trail through journalism.

Actually, my first job was helping out CNN as a news assistant on Obama's inauguration

because I graduated in January a little earlier.

I was a news assistant.

And then I went to the New York Post and I covered a lot of local and national politics.

But I did cover the 2012 campaign a little bit,

the re-elect for Obama. I was at the conventions, but I wasn't actually on the trail. I then went to

...