Welcome to Just Between Us, the podcast with all of the answers, some of the time.

A bit of a different thing going on this week.

You've been immature and you've lied.

And now you're trying to turn it on me and manipulate me and gaslight me.

I was trying to manipulate you.

Diana, you would be chucking their clothes out of the window.

I know, I'd be like, are you joking?

I don't know.

I guess you'd have to ask.

Someone that has sex.

Someone that has sex.

And remember, it's just between us.

Hello and welcome to the History Extra podcast from BBC History Magazine and BBC History Reveal.

I'm Ellie Cawthorn.. In the mid-19th century, Richmond, Virginia became a hub of the domestic slave

trade in the US. But one institution stands out in the city's story, a place called Lumpkins Jail.

In her new book, The Devil's Half Acre,

Kristen Green uncovers the life and legacy of Mary Lumpkin,

an enslaved woman whose children were fathered by her enslaver Robert Lumpkin.

Speaking to Emily Briffitt,

Christian explained how Mary fought for her children's freedom and ultimately founded one of the first historically black colleges and universities in the US.

So hi Kristen, it's lovely to be chatting to you today.

Thanks for having me, Emily.

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