This is the Cater Daily Podcast for Saturday, January 11, 2020. I'm Caleb Brown. The third-party doctrine is a creation of courts. It's a notion that you have no privacy interest in information you give to others. So how much longer can it

last in a world where our thoughts and transactions can almost immediately be transmitted

all over the world? And what can states do to mitigate the privacy harms.

Billy Eesley is a senior policy analyst at Americans for Prosperity.

We spoke last month in Phoenix.

How long do you think the third party doctrine is going to remain?

We've had multiple Supreme Court justices, specifically Sotomayor and Gorsuch be pretty skeptical of that view.

I don't think it can remain in the 21st century for much longer.

I hate to make bets, but I'm going to make a bet. I think once we get to, I would be surprised if we get

into 2030, 2040 with with that third-party doctrine being the same as it is now.

Now I want to be clear about this.

I think the court has not explicitly rolled back the doctrine, but they clearly needling at it and trying to figure

out how do we have a Fourth Amendment that adequately protects people and respects their privacy rights in a 21st century

sort of framework and personally I don't know how you can have the third-party doctrine and respect all of those frameworks and respect people's privacy. I don't think it works.

Okay, so at the state level, police have, it's kind of the wild west when it comes to a lot of new technology

that can be used to surveil people, to gather information about them, to get their information without a warrant.

So I guess how do you evaluate that landscape right now?

I think the landscape is not great for civil liberties at all on the state level and I think the reason why is because

most states

Honestly most law enforcement is perfectly happy with the status quo, which allows them to gain as much data as necessary through

stingray devices that can attach to cell site location,

not satellites, but no satellite so I'll go with that word and honestly I kind of feel like there have been a lot of

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