How AI Will Impact the Future of Work

On with Kara Swisher

New York Magazine

Society & Culture

4.2 • 3.2K Ratings

🗓️ 16 October 2025

⏱️ 56 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

Will artificial intelligence be a job creator or a job destroyer? Who will be most affected — and how long will the AI revolution in employment take? Futurist Martin Ford and economist Betsey Stevenson join Kara to unpack the realities behind the AI hype. They explore the impact of artificial intelligence on the future of work, from the fate of blue-collar jobs amid advancing robotics to the government’s role in helping workers navigate this new era. They also dive into ideas like universal basic income and a digital dividend, and examine how AI could redefine our economy, society, and the role work plays in a meaningful life. Martin Ford is the founder of a software development firm and the author of four books, including the New York Times bestselling Rise of the Robots: Technology and the Threat of a Jobless Future. Betsey Stevenson was the chief economist of the US Department of Labor from 2010 to 2011, and then served on the Council of Economic Advisors from 2013 to 2015. She's a professor of Public Policy and Economics at the University of Michigan and serves on the executive committee of the American Economic Association. Register for Smartsheet Engage here! Want to see Kara and Scott Galloway live during the Pivot Tour November 8th-14th? Get tickets and details at PivotTour.com. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0	Hi, everyone from New York Magazine in the Vox Media Podcast Network.
0:16.2	This is on with Kara Swisher, and I'm Kara Swisher.
0:18.9	Today, we've got a conversation between futurist Martin Ford
0:22.2	and economist Betsy Stevenson on the effects of artificial intelligence on employment. Ford has
0:28.7	been thinking and writing about the effects of AI and jobs long before it was in the zeitgeist.
0:33.1	He's the founder of a software development firm and the author of four books, including the New York Times bestselling Rise of the Robots,
0:40.6	Technology and the threat of a jobless future, which won the 2015 Financial Times-Makenzie Business Book of the Year Award.
0:49.0	Stevenson is a labor economist who researches the effective AI on work.
0:53.9	She was the chief economist of the U.S.
0:55.7	Department of Labor from 2010 to 2011 and then served on the Council of Economic Advisors from
1:01.6	2013 to 2015. She's a professor of public policy and economics at the University of Michigan
1:07.5	and serves on the Executive Committee of the American Economic Association.
1:12.5	Martin and Betsy are two very deep thinkers on this topic and couldn't be more vital.
1:17.0	A quick note before we get to the episode, I'm doing a live pivot tour with my co-host Scott Galloway.
1:22.2	The tour runs November 8th through the 14th and it hits Toronto, Boston, New York, D.C., Chicago, San Francisco, and L.A.
1:30.0	We are sold out in several of those cities and almost sold out in most of them, but tickets are still
1:35.3	available at Pivotor.com in some cities. All right, this is a really sharp conversation, so stick
1:42.6	around.
1:57.4	Thank you. is a really sharp conversation, so stick around. Support for the show comes from SmartSheet.
2:00.0	In today's episode, we debate the future of work
2:02.8	and what it looks like with AI. But while the experts debate, your team needs to get work done.
2:08.5	SmartSheet is the enterprise-grade platform that helps you rise above the uncertainty. It lets you harness
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