Any Christian that isn't amazed that he wakes up believing doesn't understand theology,

doesn't understand remaining corruption, and doesn't understand the absolutely essential

keeping power of the Holy Spirit. So I'm just going to say, God, thank you. Because when I see those fallen people,

I would say, it could have been me. But for one thing, he kept me. Welcome to the Crossway

podcast, a show where we sit down with authors each week for thoughtful interviews about the Bible,

theology, church history,

and the Christian life. I'm Matt Tully, and today I'm talking with John Piper.

John is the founder and teacher of desiring God.org and the chancellor of Bethlehem College and

Seminary. He served for 33 years as the senior pastor of Bethlehem Baptist Church in Minneapolis, Minnesota,

and is the author

of more than 50 books, including Why I Love the Apostle Paul, 30 Reasons.

Today, John and I discuss God's sovereignty, pastoral burnout, and the sin of racism.

He reflects on how it is that God can be absolutely sovereign, and yet humans be morally accountable,

explains how he sought to protect himself from burnout and moral failure as a pastor,

and recounts his own struggle with racism and prejudice as a young man.

Let's get started.

Well, John Piper, thank you so much for joining us today on the Crossway podcast.

Thank you so much. I'm glad to be here.

In addition to Christian hedonism, there are at least two other doctrinal emphases

that I think have characterized your ministry over the years.

And these are doctrines that at times have been controversial among evangelicals.

And those are complementarianism and the conviction that God is absolutely sovereign over all things. And I'm struck, though, that some of the most

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