My mindset is that you don't ever want to test market things with capital because when you're talking about capital and you're talking about debt

Rather it's a bank or an individual's that's somebody else's money and I've just found that you really don't want to mess with other people's money or their family.

If it's used the right way, and I think that in today's world, the more you can do without

debt is strong.

Yeah, I agree.

It's tricky once you get friends and family involved.

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Ladies and gentlemen, Vic Keller in the building today, my man, how's it going?

Going good man, how are you Sean? Thanks for having me.

Absolutely, man, you've got quite the story, selling companies to Warren Buffett,

getting acquired by Berkshire Hathaway.

I'd love to hear how that happened, man.

Well, you know, I don't think it's interesting to hear really how that transaction happened.

It was really the path to what's most interesting is just how I built those businesses and you know as a

as a young guy with no capital no resources just a lot of passion and vision and

drive and I wanted to build great companies and I've been studying and just kind of reading

deconstructing success for many years reading books that were written gosh about

great legends like Warren Buffett but also you know guys like

Richard Branson and people that know how to build brands and systems and processes

...