Hi everyone. I'm Nikolai Tangan, the CEO of the Norwegian Southern Wealth Fund. And today I'm in really

great company with one of my favorite people, Jeff Garrett. Now, Jeff is the dean of the

University of Southern California, Marshall School of Business and has an incredible track record.

And I know him from when he was the dean at the Wharton School. Actually, he was the first person I called when I got the job in the Norwegian Southern

World Fund to ask him, you know, what am I going to do?

Also, Jeff has held very important roles at Oxford, Stanford and Yale.

So, Jeff, big welcome.

Hi, Nikolai. It's great to be on with you.

What's the number one skill a leader needs today?

So, you know, I think the world of leadership is changing a lot.

You know, for me, maybe it's a bit glib, but I would say we used to think about leaders as

heroes and now we need to think about leaders as humans.

So I think my answer would be to be more human.

Can it be taught?

Classic business school question.

My classic answer to that is you might not be able to teach leadership, but our students

can certainly learn to be leaders.

And I think that means that leadership education has to be very experiential.

What does that mean? Experiential, I think, means in the first instance, learning about who you are

as a person, who you want to be. Then second, how do you interact with others, become self-aware and self-reflective.

And then once you've done those two things, you can think about leading organizations.

But for me, it's very much inside out these days.

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