Hello, this is Carl Raymond, host of the Gilded Gentleman History podcast, where every two weeks we journey into worlds light and dark in America's

Gilded Age, Francis Bel-Ipac and England's late Victorian and Edwardian eras.

There's been so much that has attracted fans of HBO's opulent drama series, The Guilded Age,

from the stunning sets, costumes, and on-location shots that all just transported us

to a complicated time of extravagance and power, but also poverty and prejudice.

Of all the plot points that audiences love to follow, it's always a love story that can

capture the attention and the imaginations of just about any of us. And the Gilded Age has had

a number of love stories, some ending well, as we see with Peggy Scott's

memorable moment at the end of season three that's just completed airing this summer.

But some love stories haven't ended well, are ambiguous or have had tragic ends.

And one profound love story in particular was hidden from public view altogether,

unless, of course, you knew where and how to look. And that was the love story of Oscar Van Rine

and John Adams. Being a gay or a queer couple using our modern vernacular in the late

19th century America, and often throughout history,

was a challenge given social expectations and assumptions. To understand it all properly and put it

in context, we need to remove our modern glasses and understand how a same-sex romance may

have been ignited and flourished in times very different from our own. But love is love

after all, regardless of the century and the love affair between any two committed people can

produce ambiguity, confusion, pain, but also joy. Joining me today to take a look at an imagined

gay love affair of the Gilded Age

and what the experience of living as a gay man in that society might have been like

is my guest today actor Claiborne Elder who played the truly memorable role of John Adams,

...