I did not want it to be anxiety, depression, any of that.

As a former operator, you do not feel good about admitting something like that. And through that sharing, you realize that you're not alone, that this isn't wrong. You're not strange or weird or broken. It's fairly common. Yeah, it is. And talking is a way of releasing that energy. That was one of the hardest things I had to do. That was a major step forward, though, was accepting it, being open about it, and not making it something that I'm ashamed of learning from it and being able to talk about it and help others through it.

I think that what you just said is so powerful to be able to come together, that deep connection that starts with yourself and then extends to others.

This is all in retrospect, but that was my way of trying to fix it, was diagnosing where it

came from, why it's happening, and how I can get rid of it ultimately. And that led to this

endless thought cycle. And then, to be honest, the biggest thing that has helped me through

healing is... Welcome to the Mark Devine show.

I am your host, Mark Devine.

Super stoked today to have another opportunity to go deep and talk about things that are really

important to all of us.

And my guest today has a lot of experience, not too dissimilar than mine.

Nick O'Kelly is a retired Green Beret, Special Forces, a member, and he was a former

160th Special Operation Aviation Regiment.

Pilot.

Nailed it.

Flying Black Hawk, Flying Rangers and Green Berets in these wickedly cool blackouts,

Black Hawk helicopters in dangerous places.

Can't wait to hear about that.

Of course, he's an entrepreneur now.

He's out.

He's a husband and father.

He spent over a decade operating at the highest levels in the military.

...