Free Thinking – Delacroix. Petain, De Gaulle. Jonathan Lynn
Arts & Ideas
BBC
4.2 • 599 Ratings
🗓️ 17 February 2016
⏱️ 46 minutes
🧾️ Download transcript
Summary
Jonathan Lynn, author of Yes, Minister talks to Philip Dodd about his new play Patriotic Traitor which imagines the relationship between Petain and de Gaulle as that of father and son and follows them from their first meeting in World War I to the end of the Second World War, by which time, each had sentenced the other to death.
Suhdir Hazareesingh, author of In The Shadow of the General: Modern France and the Myth of de Gaulle, and writer and political columnist, Anne Elisabeth Moutet join Daniel Lee, New Generation Thinker and author of Pétain's Jewish Children to discuss with Philip Dodd the different notions of France that Petain and de Gaulle fought for and their post-war legacies.
And as a new exhibition Delacroix and the Rise of Modern Art opens at London's National Gallery, Philip Dodd talks to curator Christopher Riopelle about the romantic pessmism of Eugene Delacroix and his visions for both art and the future of society.
The Patriotic Traitor is at the Park Theatre in London from February 17th to March 19th. Delacroix and the Rise of Modern Art is the National Gallery in London from February 17th to May 22nd.
Producer: Jacqueline Smith
Transcript
Click on a timestamp to play from that location
| 0:00.0 | Welcome back to the home of the oxymoron. Evil genius. He asked the newspaper to print his obituary early so he'd enjoy it. That's like hiding at your own funeral. Yeah, a big, great gig. I'm Russell Kane. Join me to weigh in on whether the biggest players in history are more evil or genius. Becoming that rich, I'd say that is some level of genius. It also helps that it's a long time ago, right? |
| 0:23.3 | It's like the podcast version of telling your kids the ice cream van plays music |
| 0:27.0 | when it's out of ice cream. |
| 0:28.8 | Listen to Evil Genius on BBC Sounds. |
| 0:32.1 | Heroes and the ghosts of heroes past |
| 0:34.8 | snake their way through tonight's programme. |
| 0:38.1 | Later, we talked to Jonathan Lynn, co-writer of Yes Minister, |
| 0:41.9 | about his new play, Patriotic Traitor. |
| 0:45.5 | At the heart of the Nazi collaborator Marshal Péthin |
| 0:48.5 | and the leader of the Free French General de Gaulle, |
| 0:51.5 | men who knew one another. |
| 0:53.4 | Which of them saved France during the Second |
| 0:55.9 | World War? It's not a simple answer. And in a moment, we'll talk about the 19th century artist |
| 1:01.6 | Eugene Delacroix, who painted that most iconic of French paintings, Liberty leading the people, |
| 1:07.3 | with a bare-breasted woman, trickler in one hand, bare-knitted gun in the other, |
| 1:11.8 | charging over the bodies of dead soldiers and leading the citizens on. |
| 1:27.4 | But should we just honour the dead? |
| 1:30.1 | Odo Paitan and de Gaulle Delacroix and the female icon of liberty |
| 1:34.8 | still haunt contemporary France? |
| 1:37.8 | That's the question we'll be asking later. |
| 1:39.6 | Oh young citoyen, formed your battalion, |
| 1:45.0 | marcho, marcho, |
... |
Please login to see the full transcript.
Disclaimer: The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from BBC, and are the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Tapesearch.
Generated transcripts are the property of BBC and are distributed freely under the Fair Use doctrine. Transcripts generated by Tapesearch are not guaranteed to be accurate.
Copyright © Tapesearch 2026.