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The Lawfare Podcast

Fred Kaplan on "Dark Territory"

The Lawfare Podcast

The Lawfare Institute

International Law, Law, Government, Foreign Policy, News, Politics, Rule Of Law, International Relations, Current Events, Military, Constitutional Law, Intelligence, National Security, History, Terrorism, Diplomacy

4.76.4K Ratings

🗓️ 17 June 2016

⏱️ 72 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

Fred Kaplan joins Benjamin Wittes at a Hoover Book Soiree to discuss "Dark Territory: The Secret History of Cyber War."

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Transcript

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0:00.0

The following podcast contains advertising.

0:04.0

To access an ad-free version of the LawFair podcast,

0:08.0

become a material supporter of LawFair at patreon.com slash law fair.

0:14.0

That's patreon.com slash law fair.

0:18.0

Also, check out LawFair's other podcast offerings,

0:22.0

rational security, chatter, law fair no bull, and the aftermath.

0:29.0

In the first weekend of June of 1983, Ronald Reagan was up at Camp David on one of his five day weekends.

0:40.0

And watching a movie every night, he watched War Games one night,

0:44.0

because one of the screenwriters was the son of a movie star and a Hollywood producer that he knew from the old days.

0:50.0

And so they got this movie into his hands the first weekend that it was out.

0:54.0

The following Wednesday is back in the White House, and there's a big national security media.

0:59.0

At one point, he puts down his index cards and he says,

1:02.0

has anyone seen this movie War Games?

1:05.0

Okay, nobody's seen it. Just came out.

1:07.0

So he starts going into this very detailed plot description.

1:11.0

And people are kind of looking around like, where's this going?

1:15.0

And what's the up to now?

1:17.0

And then he turns to General John Bessie, who is the chairman of the Joint Sheaves.

1:22.0

And he says, General, could something like this really happen?

1:26.0

You know, could somebody just break into our most secure computers?

1:30.0

And he's well, we're going to that Mr. President.

1:32.0

And he comes back a week later and says, Mr. President, the problem is much worse than you think.

...

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