Welcome to the Colette Podcast. My name is Claire Lehman and I am editor and chief of Colette.

Colette is where Free Thought lives. We are an independent grassroots platform for heterodox ideas and fearless commentary.

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associate editor Toby Young and Canadian editor Jonathan Kay.

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Hi, my name's Toby Young.

I'm one of the London-based editors of Quillett.

Today I'm going to be talking to John Lloyd.

John is a contributing editor to the Financial Times and

co-founder of the Reuters Institute for the Study of Journalism at the University of Oxford.

His latest book is, Should Old Acquaintance be forgot,

the great mistake of Scottish independence. John recently wrote a piece for Colette

in our After the virus series called The Way We Live Next.

So John, I read your piece which I thought was an excellent tour to Horizon and it

sounded like broadly speaking you agree with the verdict of Huelbeck, which is things are going to be the same after the pandemic, but just a bit worse.

Yes, I can't see any huge shift.

I mean, people on both... Yes, I can't see any huge shift.

I mean people on both right and left and others are arguing, especially on the left, that this will

have been a new era in which the state will be much more dominant in which the state will be much more dominant and in which

...