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Atheists, agnostics, long-haired withers, short-haired withers, van derogood.

Welcome to the politics, guys. I'm Trey Orndorf, a political scientist at a little bit Christian

University, and I'm joined by Ken Katkin, a professor of law at Chase Law School, for our ongoing

Federalist Paper Supporters' exclusive show. Ken, welcome back to the Federalist Papers.

It is great to be back. It is indeed. It came to my attention recently that this project is one that actually Jay and Mike had taken on a number of years ago. And I think once again, we're just, we're showing, we're showing who's the A hosts here. We can get the job done. We can get the job done. We actually get the job done. So we have been moving forward at a pretty

bit brisk pace in all honesty. Last time, we finished up with the iconic number 10. And this

week, we're going to be moving into important Federalist papers, but certainly not iconic Federalist

Papers in 11, 12, and 13.

And all three of these are from Hamilton.

And really, what's happening here is he's marking a shift.

Madison's number 10 is kind of the epitome of philosophy.

It's this very philosophic essay. and it's one of the reasons it's

held such a long-standing, long read. Even if you haven't read a federal newspaper, it is likely

that people have encountered number 10. You can't say the same for 11 through 13. And that's in

large part because Hamilton is moving from that to what you might call kind of the cold,

hard realities of money and trade and a Navy, i.e. a global power in his view of what's going on.

And you might think about this. And it's weird when you take a look at the evidence and the

history of it, you know, from our point of view, we're looking back and we go, oh, number 10.

But number 10 was probably not a very persuasive argument at the time.

It wasn't one of the ones that, as a matter of fact, there is a pretty good, there's a pretty good state to be made that number 13 on the economies of scale is probably

...