Welcome to Our Hen House. This is Jasmine Singer.

Merry Christmas. Happy Hanukkah.

This is Mary Ann Sullivan. And this week, we're joined by the wonderful Maddie Krasno, who left her work as a primate lab worker and now works to help others do the same through her brand new organization, Justify, which is like an amazing story, but also Justify is such a great title for it. And and people love the stories of the people who changed. You know what I mean? Like the former...

I love them.

The former slaughterhouse worker that opens a sanctuary, the former this, that now

that kind of thing.

It's so dramatic in the best possible way.

And she really is, you know, you have to kind of have been in it to really be able to communicate with people who are wondering what the hell they're doing and are troubled.

And because she was in it and experienced the same thing, I think she's in an incredibly valuable position to really hear people's stories.

Mm-hmm.

The whole thing is just so insane.

I know.

It really is, but it's just...

We're all trapped in this world of, like, horrific cruelty that...

Wow, okay, hang on.

Beep, beep, beep, beep.

America says...

America is apionica.

Back, beep, beep, we're going backwards. You just said, like, one second before we recorded, you were like, let's keep things cheery. It's the holidays. It's really not my forte. It's really not your forte. No, it's really not. At least you're self-aware, you know? But that's the important thing. At least I know I'm a total downer.

Yeah.

Well, actually, I had selected several articles to talk about.

And they're all about bird flu because we talk a lot about bird flu.

...