Okay, welcome to the program. This is the other people show. My name is Brad Listy, and I'm in Los Angeles. It's nice to be with you. Thank you for listening. Happy Sunday. I have a craftwork episode for you today. Craftwork episodes for the uninitiated

feature conversations about some aspect of the craft of writing or the business of publishing.

Today we're going to be talking about craft with Matthew Clark Davison and Alice LaPlante.

They are the co-authors of a book called The Lab,

experiments in writing across genre.

It is available from W.W. Norton and Company, and this is a book that is an outgrowth of their teaching life.

And this book features 10 chapters and 90 exercises that challenge writers to cross-pollinate, to experiment, to play with different forms, to really investigate fiction and creative nonfiction and poetry, and to then push toward hybrid or entirely new forms.

So this is a book for writers who are really interested in digging deep and operating out on a wire fearlessly.

I had a great conversation with Matthew Clark Davison and Alice LaPlante about hybrid literary forms, not necessarily only

as ends in and of themselves, but also as a means for a writer to get out of a rut or to see their

work in a new light or to put themselves into a more generative, creative state. This kind of experimentation can serve either

purpose. It can be the thing that you're working towards as a kind of creative terminus, but it can also

be a tool that you can use to help yourself generate and to foment creative breakthroughs.

So you will hear us in conversation in just a moment.

Once again, I will be speaking with Matthew Clark Davison and Alice LaPlante, and their book is called

The Lab, Experiments in Writing Across Genra. Today's episode is brought to you by Tin House, publisher of the debut novel

Wanting by Claire Gia. Wanting is a searing debut novel of envy, longing, and regret across three

lives and two countries. It's a book about friendship. It's a book about desire. And it

explores why, even as it destroys us, people always tend to want more. Once again, the book is

called Wanting, the debut novel by Claire Gia, available from Tin House.

So a quick reminder about my weekly email newsletter. You can sign up for it over at bradlisty.substack.com.

It goes out once a week, and I will let you know about the latest episodes of this program.

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