So there are broadly two different chunks of gifts. There's the people in offices and then there's abilities or services, but what we actually need for the health of the body or all of these different gifts.

And so there's other places for lay people to look for gifts.

There's other passages that they can look to.

It's not a matter of trying to contort.

Ephesians for into how am I going to do this, these offices.

These are actual offices.

You were going through, who does the ushering, who does this, who does some teaching.

Some of those things are not offices but actually abilities and

service and gifts.

And you don't have to have, this is the, it's turning the clock back to the medieval period

for us to imagine that the only way you possibly can exercise your gifts in the body of Christ

is to hold an office.

That's clericalism.

Yeah, no, that's right. You don't have to hold any special

office in order to hold the general office that all of us have as Saints. applying the riches of the reformation to the modern church.

This is Whitehorse Sin, a weekly roundtable discussion about theology and culture. How is the church to make disciples? Well a disciple is one who sits at the feet of a

teacher to learn and in the church our teacher happens to be the crucified and

risen Lord. It is his church made up of his disciples. In fact he tells us in no

uncertain terms how disciples are made.

Word and sacrament ministry.

Here the words of Jesus, all authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.

He promises.

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