Europe Doubles Down on Client Side Scanning

The Lawfare Podcast

The Lawfare Institute

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4.7 • 6.2K Ratings

🗓️ 2 August 2022

⏱️ 47 minutes

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Summary

On May 11, the European Commission announced a new proposal designed to combat online child sexual abuse material. The proposal has drawn notable criticism from major member states, especially Germany, and has raised concerns about the national security risks it could create.

To talk through the issues at hand, former Lawfare managing editor Jacob Schulz sat down with two experts, each of whom wrote Lawfare articles about the EU’s proposal back in June: Robert Gorwa, postdoctoral research fellow at the WZB Berlin Social Science Center who specializes in platform governance and transnational digital policy issues, and Susan Landau, Bridge Professor of Cybersecurity and Policy in The Fletcher School and at the School of Engineering, Department of Computer Science at Tufts University. They discussed the European proposal in the context of child sexual abuse material, as well as within other contexts, such as that of terrorism. And they walked through the practical, legal, and technical implications of the draft regulation, as well as what its evolution reveals more broadly about policymaking in the digital sphere.

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Transcript

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0:00.0	The following podcast contains advertising.
0:04.0	To access an ad-free version of the LawFair podcast,
0:08.0	become a material supporter of LawFair at patreon.com slash law fair.
0:14.0	That's patreon.com slash law fair.
0:18.0	Also, check out LawFair's other podcast offerings,
0:22.0	rational security, chatter, law fair no bull, and the aftermath.
0:29.0	What we've seen over the last 10 years is law enforcement pushing hard
0:39.0	on trying to control end-to-end encryption and law enforcement pushing hard
0:44.0	more recently on the CSAM issue.
0:47.0	But we haven't seen, at least from the US, efforts to push on end-to-end encryption
0:53.0	from the national security folks.
0:55.0	And in fact, we've seen many national security people say end-to-end encryption is particularly important
1:01.0	in light of all the nation's state, kinds of theft of data, types of attacks, and so on.
1:07.0	So that's the context I've seen this particular effort in.
1:11.0	I'm Tia Suoul and this is the LawFair podcast, August 2, 2022.
1:16.0	On May 11th, the European Commission announced a new proposal designed to combat
1:21.0	online child sexual abuse material.
1:23.0	The new proposal has drawn notable criticism for major member states, especially Germany,
1:28.0	and has raised concerns about the national security risks that it could create.
1:32.0	To talk through the issues at hand, Jacob Schultz recently sat down with two experts.
1:36.0	Each of him wrote LawFair articles about the EU's proposal back in June.
1:40.0	Here's Jacob's conversation with Robert Gorwa, postdoctoral research fellow
	...

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