Esther Perel on What the Other Woman Knows

Modern Love

The New York Times

Nytimes, Redemption, Society & Culture, New York Times, Love, Essay, Storytelling, Loss, Nyt

4.4 • 8.7K Ratings

🗓️ 10 April 2024

⏱️ 28 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

Over the last two decades, Esther Perel has become a world-famous couples therapist by persistently advocating frank conversations about infidelity, sex and intimacy. Today, Perel reads one of the most provocative Modern Love essays ever published: “What Sleeping With Married Men Taught Me About Infidelity,” by Karin Jones. In her 2018 essay, Jones wrote about her experience seeking out no-strings-attached flings with married men after her divorce. What she found, to her surprise, was how much the men missed having sex with their own wives, and how afraid they were to tell them. Jones faced a heavy backlash after the essay was published. Perel reflects on why conversations around infidelity are still so difficult and why she thinks Jones deserves more credit. Esther Perel is on tour in the U.S. Her show is called “An Evening With Esther Perel: The Future of Relationships, Love & Desire.” Check her website for more details.

Transcript

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0:00.0	From the New York Times, I'm Anna Martin. This is Modern Love.
0:07.0	Today I'm talking to the most famous couples therapist in the world, Esther Perrell.
0:17.0	Esther's books, Mating in captivity and state of affairs, have forced so many of us, myself included, to rethink our assumptions
0:25.5	about love. Like maybe it's unrealistic to expect the passion and fire we feel at the beginning
0:31.5	of a relationship to last forever. And when one partner cheats on the other, what if it could actually bring the couple
0:37.6	closer instead of tearing them apart?
0:41.0	On her podcast, Where Should We Begin, Esther lets us eavesdrop on sessions with
0:45.1	real couples. People come to her with impossible problems and she somehow guides
0:50.4	them to a breakthrough. She gives them hope. When I listen to
0:54.9	Ester's podcast, I feel like I'm getting a free therapy session. So I wasn't
0:59.7	surprised in the slightest when she told me that people come up to her in public all the time and
1:04.9	ask her deeply personal questions. The grocery store is one place but airplanes is even
1:10.4	better. Oh no a stir if I would be really scared to fly. They're suspended in the air and they tell you lots of things.
1:20.0	And it is often about can trust be repaired when it's been broken.
1:25.0	Can you bring a spark back when it's gone?
1:29.0	Can you rekindle desire when it's been dormant for so long?
1:34.0	What do you do when you're angry at yourself for having stayed
1:37.6	when you think you should have left?
1:39.6	Or what do you do when you're angry at yourself when you've left and now you think you should have stayed?
1:44.4	You're like, I'm just at the grocery store, man. Like, I need to check out.
1:48.4	Yes.
1:49.4	Clearly, people are struggling so much to be happy in long-term relationships
	...

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