Hi and welcome to this week's Outlander, official Outlander

podcast. I am Tony Grafia, writer and executive producer. I'm here this week

with staff writer Danny Barrow who wrote this terrific

terrific episode 607 sticks and stones. Welcome Danny. Thank you Tony I'm

really excited to be here with you and watching the episode today. Yeah, we haven't seen this one in a while even though it aired this week. But we're let's jump right in because this is what we called a cold open, which is a scene before the main titles. And tell us a little about this scene which we called Malve's confession and how it was later in the script wasn't it when you first wrote it and then later decided to put it as a cold open.

Yeah, so initially this thing it used to take place as a sort of little flash and while Roger was giving his sermon but I think we decided that it was so you know sort of powerful to have that kind of presence of Malva being alive at the very beginning, you know, before you see her in her, you know, tragic state. And I think that was really an interesting decision, you know.

Yeah, I think it works great there because you've just seen Malva the last

last scene of the last episode was Mava, you know, dead in a horrific way and to open with this gives you a little insight into her and where her mind was at and this you know I think we had them she said I think in the last episode I should know this because I wrote that one and I totally

they all blurred together for me but I believe she says to Claire he made me stand up and tell the whole congregation. So this wasn't a scene from the book, but when you saw that in my script you were like let's see that scene and I thought that was a great decision to go what was that scene like that when her father made her tell the whole congregation?

Yeah, I mean, you know, a terrifying thing to have to do and you know, I was really eager to make sure that, you know, without giving anything a way that she is telling what is the truth to her. So it her truth so even though we may not know you know who she's referring to you know she's she's telling the truth so yeah and and this this shot I remember you put it in the script and I remember it's one of those things that kind of made me gasp a little when I read the scripts from the other writers I'm always like I'm seldom surprised because a lot of it obviously you know you're used to working on Outlander all this time but when I saw the description of the ladybug I just thought that was such a beautiful touch because it was just such a delicate thing and a ladybug you know and the beauty of it and the you know juxtaposed with the awfulness of this death. I just thought that was a visual that I'm not great at thinking of that. I'm not a visual person. I have trouble with the visuals. I'm much more focused on the dialogue and the words. So I always, when another writer can do something that is the ubiquitous show not tell, I think it's's awesome and so I always love that ladybug and miraculously we we did get a ladybug and actually

film this a trained ladybug yeah trained ladybug. Yeah,

Ladybug. We auditioned some ladybugs.

Now because sometimes it's a special effect,

but this was not. This was an actual ladybug.

So, yeah. well, thank you.

And I think, you know, I think that I find personally

that sometimes I do kind of zoom in into the micro details

and that kind of helps me then build up a bigger image in my mind of what we're trying to portray.

But I love this scene. I really enjoyed writing this scene and it was you know one where you know I have so much

admiration for Katrina who is pregnant obviously at this time and having to look to work on this and at the time I was also pregnant while working on this so I think we were both kind of channeling that energy and you know when Claire says those words about the baby being so full of light and life.

Oh it's heartbreaking that was that was something that you know I thought was you know very emotional and something that I definitely wanted to include that little nod to the book there about the, you know, the light, the blue light which we don't include here, but right, I talked about that in the death scene from last week, the blue light on the baby from, you know, from the book mentioned.

And but some of the other stuff here, I loved line where Tom Christie is like, did she die quick? And you think that he cares about her and he wants to make sure she didn't suffer, but he's really just worried did she have time to pray for forgiveness so that her soul is saved and to have him say she can't be buried in the consecrated ground at the church is just, you know, I mean it just he lost his daughter but again he's such a man so steeped in in his head and the

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