Yeah, there's a sense of real that the rest of us, by many of these folks at least, that

the rest of us are really held in real disdain.

Yeah.

And that they are, you know, they're magnificent somehow, and the rest of us aren't.

And so there is a, there is a kind of component to this, it's not, am I trying to stress this

in the book, both for the earlier projects in the 60s and 70s, but also for a lot of the

projects happening today, which you've talked about in your program, this is not just about

tax haven, re-enhiding money, and so on and so forth, they have tons of lawyers, they

can find ways to make money, it's not that hard, I mean, it really is an ideological project.

And it's a project that's embedded in different kinds of deeply flawed ideas about humanity.

Well, maybe we can go back to some of those projects in the 60s.

I know that that was like basically the heyday for some of this stuff, crazy, 68, big

year for radicals of all stripes.

And I got to say, 60s and early 70s was a, was a, was a really fantastic time period for

people with all political stripes to leave, maybe the place that they were living and

join an ill-advised trek or perhaps a commune or maybe even a people's temple, somewhere

out in a remote area and where things eventually go wrong.

Yeah, I mean, absolutely, one of the things I try to stress is that it's the rise or the

sort of heyday of the new left, but it's also the heyday of this kind of libertarian right.

And as much as we remembered as the age of Aquarius, we could also remember it as the

age of Atlantis.

Atlantis is the touchdown kind of symbol for the libertarians of the 60s and the 70s.

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