Hello and welcome to Forever 35 a podcast about the things we do to take care of ourselves. I'm Dory Schifrier and I'm Elise Hugh and we are just two friends who like to talk a lot

about serums. And today we have, I mean, I always hesitate to be like,

this was one of our best conversations with

with our guests and think that they all bring so much,

but this conversation in particular,

to me, goes into the February 35 Hall of Fame. It's just one mic

drop after another after another so much insight I needed to have this

conversation. Yes. Because we have been going through such a turbulent

summer.

It's like I've aged 10 years in one week and we got to speak to our guests today.

Oh, she was just so wonderful.

So we are just gonna kind of get right into it.

I'm gonna introduce her and then we will get into our conversation because it was so great.

I don't want to like waste another second.

So today we are talking to Tressy McMillan Kottum.

She is a trenchant cultural critic, celebrated sociologist, an award-winning writer.

She is known for rearranging your brain in the span of a carefully

turned phrase and I would say she did keep track of how many times your brain gets

rearranged in the course of this conversation. I'm just going to say.

Her breath is truly phenomenal.

It moves from the racial hierarchy of beauty standards

and the class codes of dressing for work

...