If the Bernie Sanders that went to Nicaragua met with the Sandinistas, met the Bernie Sanders that's tweeting about Ukraine funding today, they might have a lot to talk about.

They might not know each other too well.

And that's why I think it's useful to use elections to organize a movement.

Can you create a long-term movement through election organizing?

Maybe.

But I think also organizing around ideas and showing that people

power works independent of a candidate or political figure might be more useful.

Music Thank you. I'm really thrilled to have for the first time on Bad Faith podcast, Jessica Burbank. You may know her as a Friday co-host on Rising. You may know her

from her viral TikTok explainers where she is one of the best lefties on the platform, in my humble

opinion, really compellingly explaining all of the things that we talk about for hours and hours

on end on this podcast at a much more succinct manner. She has an MPA from Brown in Data-driven Policy and was also an Iowa field coordinator for Bernie 2020. Is that right? That's true. Yeah. All right. Well, welcome to bad faith. Jessica. I can't believe it's taken us this long to get together on here. But here we are. We finally did it.

All right. So there has been a lot going on in the lefty sphere. Let's start with talking about

some of the most unexpected news in the electoral context. Chang Yugar seemed to hend on breaking

points last week that he was so frustrated with the candidates that the Democrats were putting forward that he was considering throwing his hat into the ring. So, Jank, tell me more about your thinking. Yeah. Timeline. What are you weighing? How serious are you? Yeah. So I already thought about it before and I rejected it because I know what they're gonna do. You know, you're an outsider,

radical, they're gonna dredge up things from 1987 and when you were a junior and junior high school.

They already did that to you. I think they did that to you. Yeah. Yeah. Of course. And they're gonna go

to any outsider and shred them to pieces. Sure. And I'm now so desperate for making sure that we

win that I think I'm already destroyed, right?

Like they've already attacked me 10,000 times, right?

So come at me, bro.

And some people have even speculated that the announcement that Nina Turner has been hinting at over the past month or two, maybe has some relationship to throwing her hat in the ring, either as a

candidate or as a vice presidential candidate alongside Chang. What do you make of that?

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