I started to ask myself rather than being the planter, maybe I'm the soil and I'm this dark,

moist, fertile soil, but I haven't spent enough time getting my hands dirty in my own mess,

right? Like the very foundational core elements of me, rather than trying to constantly plant and yield and produce, what if I've had everything that God intended for me to have within myself this whole time?

But because I've been so obsessed with trying to grow something that I thought needed to grow out of the soil,

that I haven't let what really needs to come out, come out.

Hello, I'm Susan Hinkley.

And I'm Cynthia Winward.

And this is at last she said it.

We are women of faith discussing complicated things.

And the title of today's episode is, Navigating the Fallow Years, a conversation with Kaisa, Berlin Kalfusi.

Welcome, Kaisa.

Thanks, you guys.

I am so happy to be here.

And I was looking over some of this transcript,

and I didn't realize I've done this a couple times. So this is a really happy place.

You've done this six times? Yeah. I couldn't believe it when I looked it up. I mean,

for any of our listeners who were interested, Kaiser was on episode 36, episode 54, episode 54, 89, 125, and 162. And I will link to all of those in our show notes so that people can go back and listen and kind of catch up on more of your story. We are always absolutely delighted to have a conversation with you about anything. Yeah,

but we're particularly interested to have a conversation today. We're talking this season about

women navigating transitions and change. And you said something to us, I think at a book signing

event, you said something to us about being think at a book signing event, you said something to us about being

in fallow years.

And that just, both of our ears perked up immediately.

...