And if you're operating on the theory like I am that this was a much broader plot that the FBI knew a lot about and perhaps had a hand in,

they would have known a lot more than what they led on and what really would Joe Carr have given them.

I mean, it seems like a kind of a dumb stoner college student who got roped into this by his brother.

It seems to me like a way to try to tie this up by getting him to say some things that kind of close the book on this whole case without implicating anybody else.

Because you know, I don't really see you know like we've said they still don't know who made these bombs for instance.

And we think that if we think that Daniel Morley did it, then it's possible the FBI already knew that at that point that there were other people who were involved in this who perhaps had made these bombs.

Certainly there are a lot of allegations that McFee mentions in her book that the FBI already knew the identity of these two guys before they had been caught.

So I think that the this sort of because it's sort of like the public safety exemption right that that yeah, you know in the interest of public safety the FBI has to do this interrogation.

Well, what what could Joe Carr have really known and what do we think the FBI might have already known themselves at this point?

Is that was that really the reason that they were interrogating him or was that just sort of a pretext to try to get him to say some of the criminating things that they can use it a later date.

Well, they didn't he certainly we know that.

So, I think Joe Carr did it know that Tamerlin was dead because the FBI repeatedly lies to him and says that Tamerlin is still alive.

So, he's been in jail for four hours and then he goes you know he has a break for 30 minutes and then it's an hour and then he has a break for six hours.

You know, I mean it's it's you know it's it's spaced out it's in different chunks.

Because again, he's on a shit ton of fentanyl and it's very clear that he's in and out of consciousness and falling asleep and you know trailing off.

So, he's actually communicating on notepad through this whole thing. He continually asks like for his brother like where's my brother is he okay what day is it he doesn't know what day it is.

You know what's going on where am I and the FBI tells him that Tamerlin's alive he's alive you know tell us more about the plot your brother's fine you know all this stuff just lying to him.

He also asked for a lawyer ten times he circles lawyer on his notepad ten times they you know no lawyer is ever provided.

And at some point federal and state public defenders actually show up at the hospital because again the arrest was very public people knew what was going on.

Public defenders know what their role is here they show up and the FBI denies the entrance completely so at so then eventually a magistrate judge has and a representative from the US attorney's office has to basically show up and get and get into the room past the FBI to finally read him is Miranda rights and at that point you know joke are just stops talking.

I got to say a little advice for a listener's out there if you are ever being interrogated by somebody who's not torturing you you know they're just interrogating you and they might yell at you or whatever.

But they're just interrogating you just say oh my tummy hurts I can't answer any call.

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