All right, Jesse, we're going to skip the small talk this week because we are on vacation.

You are doing a little sex tourism in Thailand and my nephew is coming to visit me.

So I'm going to be doing some indoctrinating this week, which to be clear is very different

from grooming, no matter what James Lindsay says.

Katie, I would not do sex tourism in Thailand is way too hot.

Where would you do it, Norway?

I don't think they do.

You can talk about that off night, it's fine.

All right, so instead today we're going to re-air an interview we initially put out at the

very beginning of this show's existence back in our baby days of 2020.

That episode was called What a stupid fucking way to have a really important conversation

because we are fantastic at SEO.

And this was a conversation between me and a graphic designer at a theater company.

We had gone through a year's worth of diversity training at work with none other than

the patron saint of white fragility herself, Robin DiAngelo, after a scare quotes, picture

my scare quotes here, racist incident at the theater.

As you will hear, this training started before DiAngelo got famous, but we wanted to revisit

this for a couple of reasons.

Yeah, so one of them was just it was really early after we started the show, so it'll

probably be new to most of you.

There have also been, as you may have noticed, a few developments in the DEI landscape in

the three years since this episode came out, and we wanted to discuss them.

...