And now, from the University of Chicago Institute of Politics and CNN Audio, the Axe Files,

with your host, David Axelrod.

There may not be a better narrative writer and journalism today than Evan Osnos of the

New Yorker from the war in Iraq to eight years in China and for the last eight covering

our own country, Osnos has told large stories through the eyes of everyday people.

Now he's written a riveting new book called Wildland, the Making of America's Fury,

that explains so much about our divided country and how we got here.

We sat down recently to talk about it and his own fascinating journey.

Here's that conversation.

Evan Osnos, it's great to see you, an old friend, especially here at the Institute of Politics.

First time I've had a chance to actually sit down with someone and have a face-to-face

podcast and conversation in a long time.

So I'm glad that it's you.

Thank you, David.

It's fun to be here.

So, you know, I always begin these podcasts by probing people's stories because I'm interested

in people's stories and we rarely get them.

But in your case, it seems most important because your bio is sort of a prologue to your latest

work, Wildland, the Making of America's Fury because it's set in various places that

were important to you in your life.

So let's just start there.

And I really want to focus on your grandparents who have, you know, starkly different stories.

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