And now, from the University of Chicago Institute of Politics and CNN, the Axviles, with your

host, David Axelrod.

I've known Congresswoman Jan Chikowski since long before she was in public life when she

was an activist for seniors and consumers in Illinois.

She has an extraordinary personal story about her transformation into an organizer and

an activist and ultimately an office holder.

Shelter has some pretty provocative things to say about President Trump and where we

are today in our politics.

But before we get to that conversation, I just want to remind you that next week we'll

begin at our new home.

The Axviles will be moving to Luminary, an exciting new podcast platform where you can

find all of your favorite podcasts and for premium subscribers, you'll have access not

just to the Axviles, but dozens of great shows that will come to you ad-free.

And if you go to luminary.link slash the Axviles before April 22nd, you can take advantage

of a subscription discount for our listeners.

Now here's that conversation with Jan Chikowski.

Jan Chikowski, my great long time friend.

It's good to see you here.

You know, one of the great blessings of doing this podcast is you think you know people

and then you do all this research just to get ready for the conversation and you learn

all kinds of things.

And I was so fascinated by your family story, which is not unlike my own family story,

...