And now, from the University of Chicago Institute of Politics and CNN, the Axviles, with your

host, David Axelrod.

I've often said that one thing I learned when I was in the White House was to respect the

people who came before me, who had been in those rooms when difficult decisions were being

made, and who came there, whether they were Republicans or Democrats, with a deep commitment

to our country and its future.

Pete Wainer is one of those people.

He served in three administrations, Reagan, Bush 1 and Bush 2.

He also was a senior advisor to Mitt Romney in his campaign for President in 2012.

But now Pete has become one of the most ardent, conservative critics of President Trump.

I sat down to talk to him about how his journey led to this moment.

Pete Wainer, welcome.

Great to have you here.

You've had an interesting journey.

And so I want you to tell me a little bit about how you came to politics, which I know

you feel passionately about, how you came to evangelical beliefs, and where you are right

now in the era of Trump.

Terrific.

Well, thanks for having me.

I'm thrilled to be here, and I'm at admire of your work.

So it's a delight to be here.

Yeah, in terms of my own journey, both political and in terms of my faith journey and where I

...