Ep. 213: David Israelite | How Songwriters Get Paid — And Why the System Is Broken

And The Writer Is...with Ross Golan

And The Writer Is

Unknown, Music Interviews, Songwriting, Music, Songwriters, Education, Interviews, Music Creation, Artists

4.9 • 1.1K Ratings

🗓️ 12 June 2025

⏱️ 56 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

In this special episode, Ross Golan sits down with David Israelite, the influential President and CEO of the National Music Publishers Association (NMPA). A fierce and tireless advocate for songwriters, David has spent nearly two decades fighting for the rights, recognition, and fair compensation of music creators in an ever-evolving industry.

From spearheading groundbreaking legislation like the Music Modernization Act to navigating complex battles over streaming royalties and copyright protections, David shares a behind-the-scenes look at the work that goes into defending the value of songwriting. With unique insights into policy, publishing, and the business of music, this candid conversation reveals why David is one of the most pivotal figures working on behalf of songwriters today.

If you care about music creators and the future of songwriting, this is an episode you won’t want to miss.

00:00 – Intro: Why This Episode Matters More Than Ever

03:40 – How Songwriters Get Paid (Explained Like You’re 15)

05:19 – The Truth About Songwriter Pay: 75% Controlled by the Government

07:28 – The Music Modernization Act: Progress or Political Cover-Up?

09:13 – The Broken System: Why Songwriters Can’t Say No

12:01 – Artists vs. Songwriters: The Industry's Unspoken Divide

13:50 – Ghostwriting, Publishing Abuse & The Elvis Tax Nobody Talks About

20:16 – Why Unionizing Won’t Save Songwriters (And What Might)

23:55 – What the CRB Is — And Why It Still Screws Creators

26:22 – Free Market vs. Rigged Game: Labels Win, Songwriters Lose

28:33 – Why Songwriters Have No Real Political Power

31:01 – Consent Decrees Explained: The 1940s Laws Holding Music Back

33:19 – Selective Withdrawals: A Strategy That Could Change Everything

39:10 – Are Big Publishers Quietly Crippling Independent Writers?

45:25 – The Power of ‘No’: The One Tool Songwriters Don’t Actually Have

46:25 – Are Labels and Publishers Working Against Each Other?

49:45 – The Billion-Dollar Boom: Why Everyone’s Selling Their Catalogs

54:37 – Final Word: Gratitude, Hope & the Fight Ahead

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Transcript

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0:00.0	You have more music being consumed and more people making money off of it than in any point in history.
0:05.5	So you would think that songwriters would be doing really well.
0:08.9	The problem is that songs are not valued fairly.
0:13.9	What would the appropriate valuation be for songs?
0:17.0	Sure.
0:17.9	People will pay for something what it's worth to them.
0:20.6	There's a balance between what someone's willing to sell it for and what it's worth to them. There's a balance between what someone's
0:22.6	willing to sell it for and what someone's willing to pay for it. With songwriting, that doesn't
0:28.6	happen for two really important reasons. If you don't have the power to go dark, you will never
0:35.6	negotiate a fair price. How does a songwriter get paid? Speak to me
0:41.1	like I am a freshman in high school. The thing that's probably most shocking to anyone who
0:46.7	looks at songwriting is that NMPA is the premier organization for music publishers and their songwriter partners.
0:57.7	It's their mission to increase the value of music, and that's exactly what they do.
1:03.0	NMPA is working right now to raise royalty rates for songwriters from streaming services,
1:08.5	radio, social media, and everywhere, music is essential.
1:13.6	From the courts to Congress, NMPA works to get songwriters what they deserve.
1:19.1	I know because I've served on the board before, and I'm the current co-chair,
1:23.7	along with Ryan Tetter and Liz Rose for the Golden Platinum Club.
1:28.4	So again, thank you, NMP for supporting And The Writer is and songwriters everywhere.
1:33.7	Welcome to And The Writer is. I am your host, Ross Golland.
1:37.9	There are millions of singers and thousands of artists, but only 40 songs per genre at a time.
1:45.9	This podcast aims to shed a light on those creators who make those songs.
	...

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