This is Trend Following Radio, where great thinking comes alive.

Nobel Prize winners, legendary traders, bestselling authors, and the pros that know what drive us irrational human beings.

I am your host, Michael Coval, not filtered, raw, honest.

That's my passion.

My guest today is Marianne Lewis.

She has a book out called Both and Thinking,

embracing creative tensions to solve your toughest problems. As the dean of a business school,

she's got some perspectives. But ultimately what she's giving here in her newest work with her co-author,

Wendy Smith, is a toolkit for navigating. And look,

you know me, I want systems. I want processes because there are so many intractable problems

that we're dealing with on a non-stop basis. How can we step back and look at whatever that

discomfort is, whatever the turbulence is, whatever the turbulence is,

whatever the problem is, how can we look at it?

Take a step back and look at it with clear eyes to go about solving or navigating the situation.

Without any further delay from me, let's jump right into my guest today, Marianne Lewis.

Marianne, going through your work, I noticed, and it only happened a couple times, and I thought

this could be a

great place to jump in. It's such a delicate subject. I don't even know the word to describe it,

because somebody is going to say, however I describe it, is wrong. But if I would just say,

okay, there are some examples that you use in your work of racial issues in America. Maybe we could

call racial strife, racial violence. There's a couple examples that come up in your work of racial issues in America. Maybe we could call racial strife, racial violence.

There's a couple examples that come up in your work. It's kind of pronounced because it stands out.

...