Oh, hey, it's the lady who never unpacks her toiletry kit because you never know when you got a jam.

And welcome back. You're here for wine, part two.

Last week we chatted with the very charismatic, encyclopedically informed Andre Houston Mac,

who gave you an in-depth and a very spirited discussion of all the different wines,

how to drink them, so-called

old world versus new world wines, what gives a wine its taste, label drama, the rise of the

sometimes hit or miss, funky, kombucha tasting, organic or biodynamic wines, how to order

in a restaurant, what to look for. That was great start there. This week, we're so lucky to talk to

a pair of indie winemakers and analogists from a family-owned winery in California. And one was

born and raised in Spain. The other is a member of the San Agnes Band of Chumash Indians,

and was the first Native American to own and operate a winery in the United States.

And together their winery, it's called Kamines to Dreams, meaning the path to our dreams.

They make wines with this low intervention, natural yeast, low sulfites.

We'll talk about what those mean later, as well as what got these two into winemaking,

how grapes are harvested, why some are juiced with the stems, some weird balloon coffin chambers,

wooden tea bags, lab work, tips for making your own wines, how they met, and the surprising storytime on how they became a married duo in life

and in work. But first, thank you so much to patrons at patreon.com slash ologies for supporting the

show for the last nine years and submitting questions that are smarter than mine. Thank you to everyone

out there marching around in Ologies merch at Ologiesmerch.com. And for folks

who need G-rated kid-friendly episodes, we have a spin-off show called Smologis. And you can find that

just by searching Smologis, S-M-O-L-G-I-E-S in your favorite podcast app. Subscribe,

Tell Friends. Also, thank you to everyone who leaves reviews

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