Emma Goes to War with Joseph Smith over Polygamy - John Turner Pt. 36 | Ep. 2133
Mormon Stories Podcast
Dr. John Dehlin
4.5 • 5.7K Ratings
🗓️ 3 April 2026
⏱️ 183 minutes
🧾️ Download transcript
Summary
Welcome to Part 36 of our Joseph Smith Podcast series with Dr. John Turner covering his new book “Joseph Smith: Rise and Fall of an American Prophet.”
Today we are covering Chapter 28: "Anointed" that covers 1843.
In this episode, we explore one of the most explosive and painful chapters in early Mormon history –Emma Smith’s direct opposition to Joseph Smith over the practice of polygamy. As tensions rise within Nauvoo, Emma confronts the growing reality of plural marriage, leading to deep personal conflict, secrecy, and division.
We examine Joseph Smith’s controversial marriages, including his sealing to Helen Mar Kimball, and the broader system that introduced young women into polygamy –often through pressure, family influence, and religious framing. Through firsthand accounts, journals, and later testimonies, we unpack the human cost of these relationships and the theological justification behind them.
This episode also dives into Doctrine and Covenants 132 –the pivotal revelation on plural marriage –exploring its origins, its impact on Emma, and the broader implications for Mormon theology and authority. We discuss questions surrounding consent, power, sexuality, and the role of women, alongside the cultural and religious environment that allowed polygamy to take root.
As the conflict escalates, Emma begins pushing back –publicly and privately –while Joseph attempts to solidify the practice doctrinally. The episode culminates in one of the most controversial and secretive ordinances in Mormonism: the Second Anointing.
If you’d like to help keep this project going, please consider donating to support this series here. Your support makes long-form, in-depth historical discussion like this possible!
Purchase John Turner’s book here.
Let us know your thoughts on a Brigham Young series (comprising ten episodes) covering John Turner’s book Brigham Young: Pioneer Prophet.
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Transcript
Click on a timestamp to play from that location
| 0:00.0 | Hello, everyone, and welcome to another edition of the Joseph Smith podcast, brought to you by Mormon Stories podcast. |
| 0:06.3 | I'm your host for today, John DeLinn. It is March 13th, 2026. We have recorded three episodes in a row, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday of this week. |
| 0:17.1 | We are going gangbusters reviewing this book, Joseph Smith, The Rise and Fall of an American |
| 0:24.6 | Prophet by Dr. John G. Turner. |
| 0:27.7 | Last episode, we covered chapter 27, second half of chapter 27 of his book. |
| 0:35.2 | The chapter was called Deep Water. |
| 0:37.0 | This episode, for me, is all about Emma Smith, the wife of Joseph Smith, confronting him |
| 0:46.0 | and opposing him over his practice of polygamy. |
| 0:52.0 | We're going to be talking about Joseph marrying probably his most |
| 0:57.9 | controversial wife, which is Helen Mark Kimball, a 14-year-old. We're going to be talking about |
| 1:05.6 | Hiram pressuring Joseph Smith to put to paper a revelation formalizing the practice of polygamy |
| 1:15.0 | as instructed by Jesus Christ himself, which eventually turns into Doctrine and Covenant |
| 1:20.4 | Section 132. |
| 1:21.8 | That gets presented by Hiram and not Joseph to the Navu High Council. |
| 1:30.3 | And then Joseph has to deal with Emma, |
| 1:36.8 | his wife's opposition to polygamy. I kind of just told the whole episode, we could pretty much wrap up, John Turner. Yeah, but you know, the devil's in the details, John. There's, |
| 1:41.2 | there's a lot going on here. and I think there are also a lot of |
| 1:46.6 | things here that a lot of church members have questions about a lot of outsiders to the |
| 1:55.0 | tradition might have questions about so we can we can get into it. And I forgot to mention that this episode ends with perhaps the most secret and |
| 2:06.4 | controversial ordinance of all in Mormonism, the second anointing. |
| 2:11.8 | In fact, chapter 28 of your book is called Anointed 1843, and we're going to end talking about the super secret |
| 2:21.1 | practice of the second anointing that Joseph introduces. |
... |
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