Elizabeth Day is a world-renowned podcast host. She's a best-selling author, she's a successful journalist.

I felt like a failure, but I probably wasn't. It was what I've been told to feel.

I've had countless failed relationships and then it sucks.

Like heartbreak, there is no pain like heartbreak.

I now realise that I learned something very instructive from each one of those relationships

and from the fact that they ended.

It taught me something that I needed to know about myself.

Infertility and miscarriages are not a mishap.

Like for people who experience it, it's a tragedy over which they have no control.

And the idea that I was exploiting it to make a full-time

career out of it was so insulting because I know how fucking painful and traumatic it is to go through. Being vulnerable.

Something I think we will find it incredibly hard to do and after hearing my

guest's story today I had tears in my eyes maybe three or four times and that's

because she is willing to be vulnerable and honest and open about her truth, her trauma and the things she's learned from her most testing times.

Elizabeth Day is a world-renowned podcast host. She's a best-selling author, she's a successful journalist, honestly, she's quite frankly,

one of the most wonderful, smart, lovely people I've ever had the privilege of doing this podcast

with. In fact, today, one of the issues I had with this

podcast was we agree on so much that it's hard to play Doubles advocate with

her. It was hard to challenge her views because so many of them represented mine. It felt like she was reading out of my book. interviews because she

so many of them represented mine it felt like she was reading out of my book.

I think that's powerful because she helped me build on my ideas and some of these

ideas are controversial for some people maybe too controversial. It is remarkable how much

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