Elaine Pagels: Love Pulls You Forward

Everything Happens with Kate Bowler

Everything Happens Studios

Health & Fitness, Religion & Spirituality, Society & Culture

4.8 • 4.7K Ratings

🗓️ 7 March 2023

⏱️ 40 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

Over thirty years ago, Elaine Pagels’ young son and husband died within the same year. In this tender conversation, Kate and Elaine discuss surviving the aftermath of such devastation, the painful explanations religion often offers, and how we love and keep loving even after so much tragedy. Together, they discuss: The need for connection to others during grief Religion’s often painful and punitive explanations for suffering (and why they aren’t helpful or complete) Why parents often feel like they’ve “failed” when a child dies How suffering pulls us closer to mystery This episode is for someone who has ever had the thought “haven’t I suffered enough?” Elaine and Kate are trusted companions in a life that hasn’t turned out like we thought it should. CW: death of a child, death of a spouse *** Looking for the transcript or show notes? Click here. Find Kate on Instagram or Facebook or Twitter. THE LIVES WE ACTUALLY HAVE: 100 Blessings for Imperfect Days is out now. Learn more, here. We have free Lent guides for you to use by yourself, with a group, or with your church. Click here to get started. Leave us a voicemail and who knows? We might even be able to use your voice on the air: 919-322-8731 A big thank you to Jed Meyers for contributing his beautiful poem to today's episode. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0	Don't you wish there was some kind of cap on suffering?
0:10.7	Like there was someone keeping track and could say, yep, she's gone through enough.
0:15.8	Or no more for him, he's maxed out.
0:18.9	Only good things for them from here on out.
0:22.3	And of course, as much as we want that to be true, we know you and me.
0:30.2	That somehow everything keeps happening.
0:34.7	No matter how much good we do or how generous we are or how much faith we have,
0:40.4	or how much we manifest happiness.
0:43.9	My gosh, the amount of manifesting people are trying to do right now.
0:48.8	It's really keeping me and business friends.
0:50.9	It's really keeping my intellectual interests alive.
0:56.3	But there really is no formula that will exempt us from the realities of being a person.
1:03.1	My name is Kate Boller and this is the everything happens podcast.
1:08.7	This reality of no easy to understand formulas can be so hard to live in.
1:15.9	Especially when we've simply lost too much.
1:20.0	Or when the pain is too much to bear.
1:23.0	When the sky keeps falling, when we just can't catch a break.
1:28.8	When miracles seem to happen to other people, but not us.
1:34.2	I wanted to talk to someone who's had her own experience of shaking her fist at the sky,
1:40.1	wondering, haven't I gone through enough?
1:43.9	I feel so lucky to be speaking with my friend Elaine.
1:48.4	30 years after back-to-back tragedies had left her life undone.
	...

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