Welcome to the debrief podcast with Matthew Stephen Brown.

On this show, Pastor Matt sits down with his friends to answer your questions about life, Jesus, and the Bible.

Let's get into the episode.

Hey guys, welcome to the debrief and I'm super excited. We have been trying to get this together for some time.

We have, we have. But it is the holiday season and it has been difficult. But I'm joined today again by my friend Josh Nab, Silent K for killer. Right. But he is just an amazing guy. at uh cb u you're actually what the dean of

something uh division dean for psychology so kind of oversee all the psychology programs right and you

write for was i some christian yeah the journal of psychology and christianity so i added that journal

yeah there we go some some some you know blog right no kidding he's He's a big wig, and we're excited to have you here today.

And I'm super excited.

And I was sharing this with you before the show started.

One of the things that I think that the church needs to very delicately handle,

and I wish that people in your profession would handle this as well,

is let therapists be therapists and let pastors be pastors.

And some of the what I've experienced is

when pastors act like, you know, they're counselors. And I've seen great harm happen. And what I would

say, what I say all the time to pastors is information is not expertise. But what I would say to the

academic arena is academic degrees is not spiritual gifting.

And so, like, you've met counselors that aren't gifted.

Like, they're just gifted.

And then you've met some that got a degree.

That's right.

You know?

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