Double Hooks & Power Imbalances
The Shit No One Tells You About Writing
Bianca Marais, Carly Watters and CeCe Lyra
4.8 • 842 Ratings
🗓️ 26 February 2026
⏱️ 47 minutes
🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS
🧾️ Download transcript
Summary
In this episode of Books with Hooks, Bianca, CeCe, and Carly workshop two anonymous submissions—a YA dystopian and an adult thriller—breaking down what’s working, what’s missing, and how to level both projects up for the slush pile. First up: a YA dystopian about a society built on “modification,” where failure means servitude—and survival may depend on a dangerous twin-swap. Then they turn to an adult thriller about a woman who returns to her hometown, finds her missing sister’s diary, and uncovers links to a present-day disappearance. Packed with craft insights on hooks, openings, world-building, and psychological depth, this episode is a hands-on lesson in how to move from “good submission” to “I can’t stop reading.”
Note: CeCe Lyra is a literary agent at Wendy Sherman Associates. If you’d like to query CeCe, please refer to the submission guidelines at www.wsherman.com. Carly Watters is a literary agent at P.S. Literary Agency, but her work on this podcast is not affiliated with the agency, and the views expressed by Carly on this podcast are solely that of her as a podcast co-host ​and do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, policies, or position of P.S. Literary Agency.
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Transcript
Click on a timestamp to play from that location
| 0:00.0 | What's up, everyone? This is Cece. Do you know something I'm always looking for when I review the slush file? |
| 0:06.1 | Strong interiority. Well-written interiority shows what your protagonist is thinking about in a way that is realistic and interesting. |
| 0:14.2 | It propels the story forward instead of holding it back, but it doesn't stop there. |
| 0:19.5 | A strong writer will leverage interiority into a |
| 0:22.8 | superpower into something I call psychological acuity. Think about it this way. Plot is what happens. |
| 0:30.1 | Interiority is how your protagonist processes what happens. And psychological acuity is why it matters. |
| 0:36.8 | It gives a book depth and meaning and staying power. |
| 0:40.9 | All breakout books have psychological acuity. |
| 0:43.8 | You have been asking me to teach a course about psychological acuity for years, years. |
| 0:48.7 | Well, it's finally here. |
| 0:50.4 | Why did it take me so long? |
| 0:51.9 | Because my courses take years to build. |
| 1:12.5 | They're dense, they're thorough, and they're filled with examples and specific techniques. So this five-day course begins on March 2nd. We'll have an optional interactive component. Students are invited to submit excerpts from their work for a chance to have them critiqued live during a class. If you're ready to take your writing to the next level, join me for writing interiority and psychological acuity. Don't worry if |
| 1:18.5 | you can't attend live. The sessions will be recorded. And for more information, check out my bio |
| 1:23.6 | on Instagram or the podcast website. I'm looking forward to seeing you there. |
| 1:34.3 | Hi there and welcome to our show. The ship no one tells you about writing. I'm best-selling |
| 1:40.8 | author Bianca Murray and I'm joined by Cece Leera of Wendy Sherman Associates |
| 1:46.2 | and Carly Waters of PS Literary. |
| 1:50.0 | Hi everyone, welcome back to another Box with Hook segment. As per usual, we are diving straight in. |
| 1:56.8 | Cece, can you please kick us off? Let's do it. Dear Sisi, first, I want to thank you, |
| 2:04.8 | Carly and Bianca, for openly discussing the mysteries of the publishing world. As an amateur |
| 2:09.7 | writer without many connections to this industry, it's wonderful to feel like I have a trio |
... |
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