The following podcast contains explicit language.

Hey, this is the moment.

I'm Brian Koppelman.

Thanks for listening.

This podcast is a long time coming.

My desk today is the great Don Winslow,

who is one of my favorite writers, has been for a long time, and Don and I attempted

to do a podcast a couple years ago upon the publication of his last book and it got lost it's the lost episode and

people have been asking us online we go back and forth online a lot and folks have

long asked us to have a conversation with microphones

in front of us so Don Winslow who's the author of books like as the Winter of

Frankie Machine the Dawn Patrol, Patrol,

Savages, the cartel, all those books are books I've read

the day that they came out and loved.

And his new book, I think, is his crowning achievement.

It's called the force and Don Winslow thanks so much for being

here. Thanks so much for having me man. Let's a little reunion here. It is it's a reunion I you know, you and I have had many false starts in life.

Oh, yeah. Because, uh, look, Dave and I basically only have two projects in our lives that we thought should have been movies and warrant and one of them and the one that really crushed us for a long time and you was your book from Winter of Frankie Machine which we campaigned to get and got to do it and wrote a script that worked and we

had Martin Scrsesian, Robert DeNiro, attached to it and it crumbled.

Yeah, it did, you know. And we talked the whole, I mean one of the things that I loved about that

experience was getting to know you because we loved the book so much that normally when you

would doubt the book you just take it and go, but we included you in the process.

...