Welcome back to the podcast, bribes,

swindle, or steel.

We're in Copenhagen today, and we have a slightly different format.

We're going to debate the idea, the strengths and weaknesses,

of an international anti-corruption court.

Joining me for this discussion, Judge Mark Wolfe,

Mark is a senior judge and the former chief judge

of the U.S. District Court in Massachusetts,

and for our purposes, he's the

chairman of Integrity Initiatives International. Matthew Stevenson is a professor of law at Harvard

Law School, where he teaches, among other subjects, anti-corruption law. So thank you both for joining me.

Thank you. Thank you for having us.

You're at the very end of the Corruption Hunter's Alliance event here in Copenhagen, and everyone

has had a long few days.

So I'm delighted that you made time for this.

Mark, perhaps you can take a few minutes to set the scene for us and describe your vision

of an international anti-corruption court?

The vision for the international anti-corruption court, which is now shared by many people,

including my colleagues in Integrity Initiatives International,

who include Justice Richard Goldstone from South Africa,

the first prosecutor for the independent criminal tribunal

for the former Yugoslavia and Rwanda essentially is as follows. Grand corruption, the abuse

...