Welcome to The Investigation. I'm Chris Vlasto, senior executive producer and your podcast host.

I'm joined here now by my longtime friend and ABC News colleague Matt Dowd, also a former, what were you, a political operative, I would say.

Yeah, it was chief strategist to Bush and Schwarzenegger and a number of other candidates before

that, haven't worked on both sides of the aisle.

But however, in this presidency, you are an outspoken, say, critic of the president.

Is that fair?

I describe it to truth teller.

Okay.

That's what I tried to to truth teller. Okay. Well, that's what I tried to, truth teller.

I mean, as you know, I met with him early, or a year into the presidency.

So I've tried to be respectful to him, but I've also tried to be, you know, say what I think is going wrong or what's happening.

Well, on this podcast, Matt, we spend a lot of time dissecting the Mueller investigation and all the congressional investigations.

There are so many of them investigating Trump. It's hard to keep track. But now I wanted to get your opinion. I thought you'd be a good guess because now with the announcement that Robert Mueller is going to testify on Capitol Hill in a midsummer spectacle.

What do you think is going to happen with that?

What's the effect of that?

Well, I think any time you have public testimony on something,

it's like the difference between how much effect a book has

versus the movie about the book or the play about the book. And so I think

it will have that sort of appeal. It'll get people focused that may not have been actually

focused fully on what was in the Mueller report other than what was described as what was in it.

And so I think it will get the attention of the American public. I don't actually know

fundamentally what substantively

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