Debating Hell: Annihilation or Eternal Conscious Torment? Dr. Paul Copan and Chris Date
Theology in the Raw
Theology in the Raw
4.5 • 1.5K Ratings
🗓️ 22 February 2026
⏱️ 105 minutes
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Summary
Get your ticket for the Exiles Conference in Minneapolis! April 28-May 2! https://www.theologyintheraw.com/exiles26
In the last few months, there’s been fresh conversation about hell—sparked in part by Kirk Cameron's seeming endorsement of annihilationism. Of course, this sparked a flood of Twitter threads, and YouTube reactions about the nature of hell.
But this isn’t a new debate.
Christians have wrestled with the nature of hell for centuries. While eternal conscious torment has been the dominant view in the Western church, annihilationism (or conditional immortality) has deep historical roots as well. And proponents on both sides take Scripture seriously.
In this episode, I sit down with Paul Copan and Chris Date to talk through the biblical and theological case for their respective views. Paul is a philosopher and apologist at Palm Beach Atlantic University and the author of over 40 books, including Is God a Moral Monster? Chris is a theologian and the voice behind Rethinking Hell and Theopologetics, where he’s written and spoken extensively in defense of annihilationism.
If debates aren't your thing... don't worry. This one was super conversational and friendly. They disagree, but they're good friends and are confident enough in their convictions that they don't feel the need to attack or strawman each other.
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Transcript
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| 0:00.0 | Hey, friends, welcome back to another episode of Theology in the Raw. |
| 0:08.5 | I am so excited about this conversation. |
| 0:10.8 | Oh, my goodness, we've got two awesome scholars here today on Theology and A Ra talking about the nature of hell. |
| 0:19.4 | This is going to be a dialogue about whether hell is a place |
| 0:24.3 | of eternal conscious torment or eternal conscious punishment, as we talk about in this episode, |
| 0:29.9 | or is it a place of annihilation, otherwise known as the doctrine of conditional immortality? And I have two amazing scholars to discuss this. |
| 0:42.1 | Dr. Paul Copan has a PhD in philosophy from Marquette University. He's a Christian theologian |
| 0:48.1 | Analytic philosopher, apologist, and author. He is currently a professor at Palm Beach, |
| 0:52.8 | Atlantic University in Florida, holds the endowed Pledgeer family chair of philosophy and ethics. He is currently a professor at Palm Beach at Atlantic University in Florida, |
| 0:54.5 | holds the endowed Pledgeer family chair of Philosophy and Ethics. He's the author or editor |
| 0:59.2 | of 45 books, including one of my favorite books. Is God a Moral Monster? It is an incredible |
| 1:07.8 | book. It deals with a lot of the hard things in the Old Testament, which there are many. |
| 1:13.0 | Paul also wrote a companion volume called Is God a Vindictive Bully? |
| 1:19.0 | Paul will be a speaker at this year's Exiles in Babylon Conference doing a dialogical debate with |
| 1:25.3 | Shane Claiborne about Christians and War. Be sure to check that out. |
| 1:29.9 | I'll share more about that in a second. Chris Date has a master's degree from Fuller Theological Seminary. |
| 1:34.9 | He's an adjunct professor of Bible and theology at Trinity College of the Bible and Theological Seminary. |
| 1:40.1 | And he's one of the leading thinkers and faces of the popular Rethinking Hell ministry. |
| 1:48.5 | It's a podcast. |
| 1:49.6 | It's a YouTube channel. |
| 1:50.7 | And the website has just a wealth of resources discussing the nature of hell. |
| 1:55.7 | Chris is also the editor and contributor to several books, including Rethinking Hell and a Consuming Passion. |
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