I think part of what's so challenging about all these decisions, marriage, divorce, childbearing, not childbearing, is that it's so difficult to disentangle the expectations from what you want.

This is death, sex, and money.

The show from WNYC about the things we think about a lot and need to talk about more.

I mean, a sale.

This week, we're doing something a little different with the help of Ian Koss and the podcast he made about divorce and his family.

The series is called Forever is a Long Time. Here's a little bit of the first episode. Ian is talking with his father, Tom.

Do you remember, do you remember how Sebastian and I responded to you guys getting divorced?

Because I have no memory of this. Well, that's interesting. You should mention that.

Because that's one of the few scenes that I really can picture.

There was a therapist there at the Worthington Health Center.

Can you picture that?

Yep.

Up on the hill in Worthington?

Yeah.

We brought you guys there to tell you that we were getting divorced.

I remember that these tears just sort of spontaneously popped out of your eyes. And you just like, I don't know, I just, it was unlike you because you're quite, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you know, quite stoic in a lot of ways, but you just, like, cried instantly, and I can still see that now.

Ian grew up in Massachusetts and is 33.

He's married now.

And as he was making that decision, he started thinking about the many marriages in his family that ended in divorce,

not just his parents' marriage, but also his grandparents and aunts and uncles' marriages.

And he interviewed his family about this over the podcast's five episodes.

I wanted to talk to Ian because I have some divorce stories myself. I got divorced when I was 30.

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