Look, I think that Putin has had to have looked into the abyss or shaking the tree and he sees what falls out and it can't be real pleasing to him.

I mean, he's managed to unite NATO in a way that nothing else has since the end of the Cold War other than his annexation of Crimea and invasion of the Donbass in 2014.

Hello and welcome to the GZero World podcast.

This is where you'll find extended versions of my interviews on public television.

I'm Ian Bremmer.

And today I'm coming to you from the 2022 Munich Security Conference,

where world leaders are gathering again for the first time in two years

in a moment of unprecedented crisis. At the time of this recording, Russia's 150,000 plus troops

have yet to cross the Ukrainian border. Western officials warn that an invasion could happen at any moment.

We're joined today by former CIA director

and retired four-star general David Petraeus

who led a couple of invasions himself

to talk about this critical moment in world history.

Things look grim, there's no question,

but when it comes to the state of NATO today,

there is a silver lining.

So let's get to my conversation, Dave Petraeus.

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