David Gessner is back for his third appearance on the podcast, and this time we are discussing his brand new book "Leave It As It Is: A Journey Through Theodore Roosevelt's American Wilderness." Most long-time listeners will remember David's past two episodes-- we discussed everything from Edward Abbey and Wallace Stegner to his daily writing rituals and his hand-built coastal writing shack. If you haven't listened to those first two episodes, I encourage you to do so—they are chock-full of wisdom, good humor, and inspiration to fight to conserve the places you love. But first, take a listen to this episode, as it offers some timely insights into this current moment in history.

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In this episode, we spend the full hour discussing his new book and digging into the good, the bad, and the ugly of Theodore Roosevelt's legacy. As many of your know, I've read way-too-many TR books, and "Leave It As It Is" offers the most balanced, clear-eyed examination of the man that I've read to date. It's not a strict biography or historical examination of TR, although there's plenty of both within the pages. Rather, it's David's search to capture the best of TR's conservation ethos, to discard the worst, and to use the balance to build a new, holistic model for conservation and environmental justice. David melds together a confluence of ideals that acknowledges the wrongs of the past and sets an equitable, sustainable course for the future. During this time when we are rightfully reexamining many of our country's revered historical figures, "Leave It As It Is" provides a valuable, well-timed deep dive into the complexities of TR and his influence on conservation in the United States.

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Although an hour-long interview is no substitute for reading the book, I believe that this conversation will give you a good taste of the fresh and unique perspective that David brings to the well-worn subject of Theodore Roosevelt. We start by discussing the relevance of studying TR now, in the midst of a global pandemic, economic crisis, and social turmoil. David also explains the series of events that led him to begin writing this book, a multi-year project that took him from Bears Ears to Yosemite with many stops in between. We talk in-depth about TR's unacceptable views and treatment of Native Americans, some of the hypocrisies that defined TR's life, and why David chose to stare these uncomfortable facts in the eye rather than just make excuses, as many biographers do. David discusses how TR's idea of the Strenuous Life has helped define his own life, and how writing this book has encouraged David to become more of an activist for specific causes. We also talk about the removal of the TR statue in New York, the idea of the Confluence of Ideals, and David offers up a long list of further reading on TR.

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I loved every minute of this conversation, and I highly encourage you to read "Leave It As It Is." It's an important book that is perfect for this important time in history. Hope you enjoy!

• "Leave It As It Is: A Journey Through Theodore Roosevelt's American Wilderness" by David Gessner
• David Gessner
• Full Episode Notes and Links: https://mountainandprairie.com/david-gessner-3/
• LEAVE A PODCAST REVIEW on Apple Podcasts

• 5:00 - What is the value of studying TR during this moment in history?
• 9:00 - The Antiquities Act explained
• 12:30 - Why read biography?
• 14:00 - TR's attitude toward Native Americans
• 17:00 - Importance of open conversation and hypocrisy
• 18:30 - "Walking the ridge"
• 20:00 - David's "What would Teddy do?" list
• 21:00 - Why David had to write this specific book
• 27:00 - "Confluence of Ideals"
• 32:00 - Importance of living strenuously
• 33:30 - Combining books and adventure
• 37:30 - Focused action
• 39:30 - Morris and McCullough's TR work
• 41:30 - Thoughts on the removal of the NYC TR statue
• 46:00 - TR as an effective, energetic liberal
• 49:30 - Backstory on the title "Leave It As It Is"
• 52:30 - Who wins in a TR vs. Trump fight?
• 55:00 - How did writing this book change David?
• 58:00 - Activists that David admires
• 59:30 - Additional recommended books on TR